If you have any trouble editing the Wiki or want to ask a question, feel free to leave me a note here. Please end your message with four tildes (~~~~) to add your name and the time. Johnathan404 14:37, 16 May 2009 (UTC)
Previous posts, debates and arguments have been archived.
- It definitely has Costa Express. I didn't see a Krispy Kreme stand but then I wasn't looking for one, and there is definitely Krispy Kreme over the bridge. Johnathan404 (talk) 22:14, 14 January 2017 (GMT)
When I saw your edit about the BK/McD's scenario at Woodall with regards to the bridge (I apologise for not making that clearer; I know that Fleet will be the same when the bridge is re-connected to the southbound building), it reminded me of something. When I visited Woodall in 2015, there was a lot of work going on in the southbound building. This involved moving the toilets to an external portacabin next to the entrance and minimizing the size of the Waitrose store, I noticed that there was no bridge access to the other service area on the northbound carriageway. Do you know when this was reconnected? Thank you. Barnaby (talk) 20:17, 21 May 2017 (BST)
- I think you've been there more recently than me! It wasn't me who set it as being fully internal. I do know that by April 2016 it still hadn't been connected. Johnathan404 (talk) 17:29, 22 May 2017 (BST)
Annandale Water Services toilet refurbishment
In case you're wondering, the information I added about the proposed refurbishment is definitely true as Roadchef actually told me in an email, because I had submitted a complaint about the terrible state the gents were in.
Another thing that may be useful information is that there is a seating area opposite the toilet entrance/exits that is painted a very bright green, possibly hinting about a previous brand occupying that space.
- That's right (although Roadchef seem to be in a perpetual state of saying they're going to improve their toilets, this time they say they mean it). It has been a while since I've been to Annandale, but I believe the green was the restaurant Orchards. Johnathan404 (talk) 00:39, 2 June 2017 (BST)
- That's quite interesting. *Apparently* the manager sent her "maintenance team" down to the toilets to remove the mismatched signage and all, and I'll be able to check in July. The manager also offered me a free Costa Coffee and cake, which makes me think that they actually mean it.
Key On A-Road Services
When I made the A507 page I originally thought you did an error with the key code but you just didn't put it on A-Road pages with few services. I have put the short version on the new A-Road page. Should I keep it as the short version or change more pages to have the long version. Lc73 (talk) 10:02, 12 July 2017 (BST)
- It's only a short page, so it is fine without a key. A key would be twice as long as the page! Johnathan404 (talk) 16:39, 3 June 2017 (BST)
Strensham Picture Problem
I notice on the Strensham gallery, Oliver hyam and Rich have both posted almost the exact same pictures, with the exact same descriptions. It wastes space in the gallery and makes it look unprofessional, in a way. Could you possibly sort pictures out?
- They are different photos, although clearly very similar, which isn't surprising considering they were stood next to each other when they took it! You're right that we don't need both of them, but equally neither of them is doing any harm. Johnathan404 (talk) 00:14, 11 July 2017 (BST)
- Oh, I didn't know that! Sorry for causing any inconvenience =]
Updates on several services
I visited (or passed) several services areas on our very long road trip to Stoke-on-Trent. Each is different to a certain extent to how I found them last time I visited and how they are on the site.
The dodgy signage is still there, but the lettering has been removed. I made an effort to check the overflow seating area and there is a golden plaque announcing the opening date, and it features the former RoadChef logo. Also, some of the bodged up signage is peeling away, revealing either the old RoadChef logo or the Annandale Water logo.
Didn't actually visit these services, but judging by the state of the sliproad and totem pole, it's in a pretty woeful condition.
Burton-in-Kendal has gone through a large refurbishment recently, changing the EDC into an M&S, reflooring the entire site, refitting the toilets and replacing some signage. However, the 'Staff Only' door next to the entrance still features Granada signage!
Cairn Lodge / Happendon
Signage is messed up as hell, with a 'Cairn Lodge' logo on the northbound signage and a minimalist green castle on the southbound.
Hamilton has been recently refurbished to quite an extreme, but that doesn't stop them from vandalising the walls with laminated notices! The entrance doors are still emblazoned with 'RoadChef'.
Did not visit this site, but the (hideous) bridge is peeling back to Granada red.
All signage on the M6 still features Poplar 2000 branding, except from one sign on the northbound carrigeway.
- Are the signs you saw on the motorway or at the junction as if they are I think the Happendon page can be renamed to Cairn Lodge.
Showing Direction of facilites
I noticed on the Heartshed Moor page you changed the eastbound and westbound only display but only on the shops and motel (even though it does not show up so you have to write it separately). I think on these types of pages you should not change the design halfway through a page, to keep with not just the sites consistency but that pages consistency I was just wondering what you think and if we should change anything else to that format on that page or change it back or do something else or just leave it. Lc73 (talk) 20:39, 28 July 2017 (BST)
- Thank you for your opinion. I loathe the use of split lines for westbound and eastbound and have no plans to change the existing policy. Johnathan404 (talk) 20:48, 28 July 2017 (BST)
Should someone now mention on the services page Julian Graves was at (I have forgotten it) like how Fleet mentions Café Kenco.
Hamilton Services picture
Hi there, I noticed this photo is on the wrong page, as it is actually Bothwell. I can tell this because Hamilton no longer has the 'Welcome to Hamilton' signage which was placed on the left side of the entrance anyway, plus is also less wide at the front.
Also, I am going abroad via Newcastle airport which means we will be travelling via the A1, which could be pretty interesting.
- I don't understand because the picture you've linked to shows adverts and ordering points for McDonald's, which Bothwell doesn't have? Johnathan404 (talk) 17:56, 4 August 2017 (BST)
Bolton West services restaurant counter.jpg
Is this taken from "The Services" (that Peter Kay thing)? If so I have a slightly higher quality copy (in 576p video) and could cut any other stills out if you like --Quinny898 (talk) 00:00, 26 November 2017 (UTC)
- Yes, we are able to take a small number of low-resolution stills, ideally without any actors, for the purpose of commenting on the set. The same goes with any old film. Johnathan404 (talk) 20:55, 27 November 2017 (UTC)
Annandale Water Services Toilet Refurbishment=
I recieved an email from Kerry Gibson, Operations Manager at Annandale Water informing me that the toilets will be completely revamped starting on 11 December 2017 and being complete sometime during April 2018. Apparently the showers will be extended as well which will mean a possible reconfigurement of the toilets.
I'll be adding this to the page so customers know that the toilets will be shut.
- The toilets will not be shut. It is a phased refurbishment. While this is good news for fans of Annandale Water, I don't see that there's anything here we can use - this sort of thing happens all the time I'm afraid! Johnathan404 (talk) 15:14, 5 December 2017 (UTC)
- That's where you're very wrong. She told me they'll be REOPENING in April 2018 so they'll definitely be closed for a while. I don't want to start an argument, but I don't appreciate being put down when I have evidence from the manager of the place.
- I can assure you full toilet facilities will be available during the refurbishment work, which is in line with other projects around the country. If the plans haven't changed since the copy I've seen (which is in the public domain), the change will be noticed most at the entrance anyway. Johnathan404 (talk) 18:56, 5 December 2017 (UTC)
- Please note I recieved the email yesterday. Here it is.
I have been passed your comments through from our support office regarding the toilets.
The development works are going to begin on the 11th December and we, are hoping to have this finished by April 2018.
The toilets will be getting a full refurb along with the addition of extra showers.
Thank you for continuing to stop off at our site and I do hope that you will continue to stop over at Annandale when you are travelling up and down the motorway.
Kind regards Kerry Gibson
If you're referring to a whole site refurbishment, I've heard nothing about that and it's quite interesting.
Hello, I've just re-edited Northway page and updated it, along with adding lots of content and info. Shouldn't it be called Astwick though, as it only has a BP forecourt who call it 'Astwick'? --MMA (talk) 19:47, 24 October 2018 (UTC)
Hello, I've just re-edited Northway page and updated it, along with adding lots of content and info. Shouldn't it be called Astwick though, as it only has a BP forecourt who call it 'Astwick'? --MMA (talk) 19:47, 24 October 2018 (UTC)
- Thank you for your updates. A-road service area names are often contentious and in general I loathe to rename them because we should be using the popular name. In this instance seeing as the surviving petrol station says 'Astwick service area' above its own door it would be silly not to move it. Johnathan404 (talk) 22:44, 28 October 2018 (UTC)
Roadchef Stafford South
Thanks for tidying up my update! Just thought I should sign-up and contribute to this informative site after spending a few hours reading the lengthy planning documents for both of the Stafford South proposals on the Stafford Borough Council website. The documents are detailed and interesting, including scanned letters from the Highways Agency regarding their preferred option, letters from local residents complaining about the later-abandoned idea for the rear access, and details of Hallam Land Management's appeal. Way more than I could totally condense into a reasonable length section on the page without rambling, but hopefully what's on there is a good overview.
I was interested in this one because I grew up very nearby, and have always wondered why the two services are run by different operators. I also always thought it was bizarre how Moto Stafford North is very visible with local access via the B5026, whereas Roadchef is almost completely tucked away. Walking up Pirehill Lane along the unadopted section, you can see the wooden perimeter fence and tree screening but nothing else - I think the planning department at the borough council certainly got what they wanted in that respect! The lack of local access to the site must make recruitment much harder for them than Moto though, who in my experience have always attracted a fair amount of people from Stone as staff. On the other hand you never hear anything about Roadchef.
- Thanks for your work - I only came in to stress that this could have easily been a standard Granada pair of services, but ended up tidying a few other bits.
- Most of the '90s MSAs will have documents like this on the planning portal (I vaguely recall the one for Stafford North has a list of other sites which were studied and ruled out?) - the problem is these documents take a while to find, they take even longer to read and you usually have to read it several times and make notes before you begin to work out the story! But it's always better to have the information on here than on a government planning site where nobody can find it, especially in cases like this where it answers a big question.
- You're right that being able to get all the details in while still being succinct is a skill, and not one I claim to be any good at even after years of practice.
- I'd be curious to know how the two operators find recruitment. It must be one of the only MSAs where staff can play the two against each other and see who offers the best perks. I should think Roadchef, if not both operators, will provide a minibus, so where their staff come from will depend on where the bus goes.
Images uploading sideways
I've uploaded photos of a few MSAs and have noticed that they are flipped sideways in the gallery, but go the right way when opened in a new tab. I have no idea why this has happened as I uploaded photos taken with the same phone in January with no issues.
- Hi there, it looks like the photos were taken with an iPhone facing upright. iPhones instruct all photos to be turned 90 degrees to the left, on the assumption that you were trying to take something in landscape. If you open the photo raw in some browsers or apps they will be able to tell what's happened and correct it, but when it's embedded into the website this wouldn't work or the whole website would end up tilted to the left.
- You can rotate photos using iPhones in-built photo editor, but in future it's best to take photos in landscape as we're not taking photos of people. Johnathan404 (talk) 22:37, 7 May 2019 (UTC)
- Ah, that would make sense, I didn't know about that. I Will note that in the future.
Welcome Break Forecourts
I have recently passed Woodall services and know the Northbound services have a Welcome Break-branded forecourt and not Shell, is it alright that I've said about the forecourts without a photo of them? After checking the Welcome Break website to see about Southbound, I have noticed that other Welcome Break sites do not have Shell under the brands list, this is suggesting maybe all forecourts are now Welcome Break-branded. Also, Gretna had a BP forecourt and on the brands list is Welcome Break's 'The Deli' from their forecourts, suggesting if my previous statement is correct it may apply to BP forecourts at Welcome Break services. Is there any evidence of the rebranding? Should I look for evidence on photos to see because they would usually list the Shell or BP brand? Thank you. NOAH1 (talk) 20:16, 10 June 2020 (UTC)
- Yes, many Welcome Break petrol stations have now been changed over. Welcome Break won't publicise them under the current circumstances. For the time being please only change the ones you have seen. Thanks. Johnathan404 (talk) 15:56, 11 June 2020 (UTC)
Ollerton COVID-19 Update
I have updated the Ollerton page to say that 'The Big Fish' restaurant is now open for takeaway only. How can the page be changed to say that it was updated today. Thank you. NOAH1 (talk) 06:28, 16 June 2020 (UTC)
- Thank you. It can be done with Template:Coronavirus, but there is no need to use it. Be wary that using that template effectively creates a guarantee to keep the page updated with any developments. Johnathan404 (talk) 12:10, 16 June 2020 (UTC)
Grand Dale Little Chef
I have recently passed the shell filling station at Grand Dale. There was an abandoned Little Chef - style building with a signpost housing the Travelodge logo. Do you know of evidence about if this was a Little Chef and Travelodge site at all? Thank you. NOAH1 (talk) 19:25, 15 September 2020 (UTC)
- I'm not aware of any abandoned buildings at Grand Dale. You may be thinking of somewhere else.
Since you would know a lot more about this sort of stuff than me, I am not doubting you. However, it was the A63. I looked on the A63 page on this site to find information about this and immediately recognised the Shell filling station I had seen on a picture, albeit with no information. This one seems to be an odd one, as no site I have looked on has anything about there even being a building. There might be a Travelodge still open, and certainly some sort of building. It may have been just a police building with broken signage for all I know. However, it had a space where the old Little Chef logo could have been. I could not take a photo, as I was on the opposite side,but I was sure of something. NOAH1 (talk) 19:25, 16 September 2020 (UTC) Oddly I've just submitted that at the exact same time!
The fuel garage roof is the same shape (the design different to others) and according to Street View, there is an open Travelodge and an abandoned Little Chef, which may have been an EG casualty, as it has a recent advert with the cursive font on it. NOAH1 (talk) 19:29, 16 September 2020 (UTC)
I, and that last statement are completely wrong. Grand Dale is in fact different, and I am referring to a Shell forecourt with the same roof, and an abandoned Little Chef. What I called the advert with the cursive font, was in fact a parking bay sign from a really close distance. It had the old logo, so it might have been an R Capital closure, with the Travelodge left. This Travelodge is called South Cave. The services is a one-sided on the A63 East. Do you list this on the site? It is not signposted to my knowledge. Sorry for the mixup and thank you again for your time. After further research, this is actually West Cave, it's just both sides are apart from each other. NOAH1 (talk) 19:35, 16 September 2020 (UTC)
How do you create a map with all A road and Motorway services you've been to? I have tried just motorway, but would prefer both. And the code wouldn't come up when I pressed 'generate code' when trying to generate a code for my motorway one. Thank you. NOAH1 (talk) 19:38, 16 September 2020 (UTC)
- Simply copy and paste an existing example, and change the names to the names of the places you've been to.
- Simply add more place names to the existing page, or replace the code with your own.
The Good Breakfast
On the Welcome Break website, it claims that Harry Ramsdens is available at a few of its sites, and the good breakfast is not displayed. Leicester Forest East is an example. I visited there in late August and The Good Breakfast was still there though. Thanks NOAH1 (talk) 06:06, 3 October 2020 (UTC)
Wolviston Little Chef
I found an image on Teeside Live, when it was abandoned. I cropped it and have uploaded it three times but I still can't upload it to the Wolviston gallery.
- Newspaper photographers make their money by charging people hundreds of pounds to use their photos. That is their job. Please do not steal from them unless you are willing to pay when they ask you to. The upload form does ask you to make sure you have permission to upload. Johnathan404 (talk) 21:47, 3 October 2020 (UTC)
Okay, sorry. Is there anywhere where there is a picture of The Little Chef when it was open?
- All of the COVID-19 updates that are in the public domain are summarised on the Coronavirus page. Johnathan404 (talk) 11:36, 1 November 2020 (UTC)
Can I just say this is an amazing site and without the site I would not have learnt most of the information I know about Motorway and A-Road services. I have been fully reading and editing for a year, but first discovered the site when I searched "Alfreton Services" and the site told me everything I needed to know. For instance, I never knew EG Group operated that many Starbucks, or the fate of Little Chef. Out of all sites I use, I use this one the most. Thank you. NOAH1 (talk) 21:05, 8 November 2020 (UTC)
Scotch Corner WCPC
As I was scrolling through Moto's website, I saw that it says Scotch Corner has a West Cornwall Pasty Co. I do know that the website displays opening hours for each brand but not cabinet (Krispy Kreme, Costa Express) , however there are no hours, so it may be a cabinet, albeit never being seen within Moto. Is there any WCPC within Scotch Corner or is it a mistake, as I know operators websites can be least accurate. Thanks. NOAH1 (talk)
- This website advises that there is a West Cornwall Pasty Co. stand at Scotch Corner, in normal trading times. Johnathan404 (talk) 17:01, 31 January 2021 (UTC)
Billingham Branch of Little Chef
- The only pictures I have are in-copyright and can't be uploaded here. It was likely a Permira closure, but others may know better than me. Johnathan404 (talk) 17:51, 19 February 2021 (UTC)
This morning I took a trip up north, and see that Carcroft seems fully open. Due to an accident, I had to take a detour on the way back and couldn't get photos of Bilbrough West (which has fully opened Starbucks) or Barnsdale Bar South. I do notice that at Bilbrough Top East when I stopped, toilets are open in the building, being shut during my visit August 2020. I saw Burger King was closed but the shutters were up, so it might be open as I visited at around 08.30. Also Sainsburys signage is still intact on the totem, and the sainsbury's neon sign inside the shuttered unit is still lit, again fully intact signage. Also, I wondered why Urban Express at Leeds Skelton Lake is not mentioned under "Shops" in the pages facilities guide. Thanks and I hope all this helps. NOAH1 (talk) 20:03, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Thank you for your updates! Rich has been working very hard on keeping the Leeds closures up to date. Johnathan404 (talk) 18:36, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
John, Should the Mitchell and Butler pubs (Toby Carvery, Harvester) be in the operated section as "pub-restaurant operated by Mitchell and Butlers" like it is for Whitbread pubs instead of listing the brand? Thanks NOAH1 (talk) 19:01, 1 August 2021 (UTC)
- There is a difference between the operator and the owner. Who Harvester is owned by isn't relevant if you are trying to contact them with a lost property enquiry - you just need to know that they are the ones who are running that restaurant. So far as I can see, every Whitbread brand is listed under their brand name. I hope this helps. Johnathan404 (message wall) 22:31, 1 August 2021 (UTC)
The Happy Haddock restaurant on the A19 near Selby is signposted with the "Parking, Toilet and Restaurant" symbols from the road. Does it need to be added? Thanks John NOAH1 (talk) 12:27, 5 August 2021 (UTC)
- No, that's just a lay-by with the wrong signs. Johnathan404 (message wall) 15:01, 5 August 2021 (UTC)
On the A171 near Guisborough is a Coop Petrol Site and Subway Drive Thru that is signposted from the A171. Is that on the site? The road signs say "Services" whilst the totem said either Woodhouse or Whitehouse (I can't remember which). Thanks, Noah NOAH1 (talk) 15:06, 6 August 2021 (UTC)
- You're right, Woodhouse is missing! It will be added soon enough. Thanks. Johnathan404 (message wall) 15:55, 6 August 2021 (UTC)
I am working on a project that I thought I should let you know about. Using information off this website, Fandom and Google SV I am taking a survey of what percentage of former Little Chefs have been demolished and I'll post the results. NOAH1 (talk) 08:41, 11 August 2021 (UTC)
- Yes, Ashford Middlesex was turned into a housing estate 10 years ago. Attenborough probably still exists, but it's hard to be sure without having any evidence. Your project, although noble, may struggle as we don't know how many branches there were, or exactly where they all were. Johnathan404 (message wall) 13:57, 15 August 2021 (UTC)
I have just found a map a few minutes ago (in the same style as other location maps) on google listing every location and whether it is something now or demolished. Thanks for your continued support! NOAH1 (talk) 16:52, 15 August 2021 (UTC)
- While Ollie's map is excellent, it doesn't show every former Little Chef. New branches are often being discovered. Johnathan404 (message wall) 16:59, 15 August 2021 (UTC)
I did notice some! I am using three lists - This website's, Ollie's map and Little Chef wiki's. I'm just on Barnsdale Bar North, and have done Reading and Hyde Park as my first two before starting alphabetically. And it seems Flo's Cafe is not signed from the A1 Southbound, only with Flo's own sign, and there was cones blocking off the entry but not exit sliproad at 4:20pm today. Thanks.NOAH1 (message wall) 18:10, 15 August 2021 (UTC)
Hi John, as of 6th August 2021, after 4pm, there were no free toilets at Bilbrough East as the building now uses Greggs opening hours (6 or 7 am until 4pm) and toilets are closed after that, and the filling stations toilet was broke. Hope this helps. NOAH1 (message wall) 15:43, 16 August 2021 (UTC)
Hi John, apologies for the constant questions but was the Domino's at Leigh Delamere order on the app only and they bring it out with there being no service counter? Also I'll be stopping at a few places next weekend and might try the new Ben and Jerry's at Oxford! Thank you. NOAH1 (message wall ) 18:56, 20 August 2021 (UTC)
- I am sure there would have been an order point. Johnathan404 (message wall) 11:20, 22 August 2021 (UTC)
On the road as you exit Portland Retail Park in Mansfield, the Burger King and former Frankie and Bennys are signposted as "Services". I assume that's a mistake, but is it a mistake or is it an actual signposted services? Thanks for your time again! NOAH1 (message wall) 11:41, 21 August 2021 (UTC)
- It is actually signposted as "Services" as you well say, but it doesn't meet any of the rules outlined in MSO:Criteria. Johnathan404 (message wall) 11:20, 22 August 2021 (UTC)
Hi, I was recently visiting Strensham services southbound, and I noticed that on this site, there was no Prezzybox page. I created a basic page, and was working on the map, when I found out I had to create a template and I was told that you must be informed of any new templates. Therefore, I'd like to create Template:Prezzybox, in order to create this map. Although I've uploaded before, this is my first template creation, and I would be very grateful for any tips. Thanks! NORTHPOLARIS (talk) 13:28, 24 August 2021 (UTC)
- Thanks for your message. I have no objection to the template in principle, but I don't understand what the benefit would be. We receive virtually zero queries about Prezzybox and a search for Prezzybox will just take you to Strensham anyway.
- Brands which have only had a relationship with one MSA are best documented on that MSA's page. Johnathan404 (message wall) 18:31, 25 August 2021 (UTC)
- Thanks, anyway!
Hi John, sorry to bother you. Can you tell me how to insert a table of the services I've visited into both my user and map pages please?
Also I have pictures of Appleby Magna, Tamworth, Oxford and Cherwell Valley to upload!
- Template:User map is able to generate its own list of services visited. Just set variable 2 to "yes", as in |2=yes }}
- If you want to create your own more detailed table, the website will accept either Wikicode or HTML. The classic editor has a code generator under "advanced" > "insert" > "table". The visual editor will have an option too. Johnathan404 (message wall) 10:15, 30 August 2021 (UTC)
I am a local and after talking to other locals, it seems the cafe has closed down, and has not been open since October 2020. I have been told it is being used as a house but am not sure of that being true. Google Maps adds it is closed, and after passing it multiple times between 8am and 3pm, I can confirm it hasn't been open then. There are cones blocking the entry sliproad, but not the exit sliproad, presumably due to the property behind it. NOAH1 (message wall) 18:01, 1 September 2021 (UTC)
Apologies John, I've seen the facebook posts on the cafe page. However it has looked closed the past two months, whether the A1 Southbound Blyth sliproad update has caused a drop in trade? Thanks.NOAH1 (message wall) 18:25, 1 September 2021 (UTC)
I'm back on the Little Chef project, no hiccups! Was the Casablanca, Zaragoza branch demolished? I tried using Google street view Espana but struggled to find evidence of the building. Thanks John! NOAH1 (message wall) 17:05, 9 September 2021 (UTC)
- This one was demolished, it's one of the few foreign ones I have information on. Johnathan404 (message wall) 17:36, 9 September 2021 (UTC)
Hi, what did both LC's at Corley become please?
And after just reading the "all the service stations" category, the visiting all former Little Chefs seems interesting, as I was actually going to plan a visit on a map to all the sites (not to take, just out of interest) NOAH1 (message wall) 21:52, 12 September 2021 (UTC)
- I don't know what the Corley sites became. In fact in the case of most branches that are inside other buildings, I don't know which unit the Little Chef occupied. You might be able to use the photos under Corley to work some of it out. Johnathan404 (message wall) 19:07, 13 September 2021 (UTC)
I have counted rebuilt branches as two seperate branches, and my end result was less than I thought. I had 21 % as the result (20.85 accurately). Thanks for all the help John! NOAH1 (message wall) 06:32, 15 September 2021 (UTC)
Edits and Checkups
Good afternoon, thanks for tidying up my edits. I shall be travelling back from Gatwick on Thursday but don't know which route, if there is an MSA you need me to check something on, let me know. Thanks NOAH1 (message wall) 12:52, 19 October 2021 (UTC)
John, I have created a page for Asda On the Move, since many more shops are being rebranded. There is one thing I need help with, and that is setting the colour for the banner so that the text doesn't disappear. Thank you for your time. Noah. NOAH1 (message wall) 14:50, 28 November 2021 (UTC)